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santerdam
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« on: April 19, 2009, 04:00:57 PM » |
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For my track I am trying to make a switchpanel. On a sheet of plywood, I want to draw a track in a more-or-less symbolic way and mount toggle-switches and LED-lights as indicators. The tracklayout doesn't represent the physical layout but more a functional layout. As an example, you can check Uhlenbrock Track Controll. They also have free setup software TC-EDIT for this product. This program can draw a track, but using Anyrail is much nicer. For the switch-panel, the layout can be printed and used as a base. Nice feature is that Anyrail can also add text. Do you think such a Library can be added to Anyrail. It will only be a very basis set of elements, based on a fixed grid. I think you don't have to make different sets for N or H0. Sander Example :  |
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Duchess Of Montrose
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« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2009, 10:49:03 PM » |
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David,
I would also be interested in such an option, as I also need to build a control panel in the near future.
Charlie
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David
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« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2009, 04:13:47 PM » |
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I've been doing some prototyping, and it would look as below.
Is that what you were thinking of?
David.
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David Hoogvorst
Founder and Owner of DRail Modelspoor Software
Creator of AnyRail
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santerdam
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« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2009, 05:37:25 PM » |
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Very nice David. This really looks like the example. In the beginning I was afraid how it would look like with the little circles (connectors) but you solved that ! Great.
Many Thanks,
Sander
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David
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« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2009, 05:44:03 PM » |
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Well, to make it look good, you need to set the connector and endpoint sizes to 0.
We're still working on the details, but it can probably be added in the next release.
David.
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David Hoogvorst
Founder and Owner of DRail Modelspoor Software
Creator of AnyRail
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santerdam
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« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2009, 05:54:05 PM » |
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Good idea to "set the connector and endpoint sizes to 0". I never thought of that.
Sure you have to take some time to work on the details. I am surprised to see how fast you could implement the basic idea for this library. Next to the purpose for building a control panel, I see the .jpg or .png as a good background for train control programs. They all have all kinds of drawing-programs, which could be replaced by Anyrail.
Sander
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tony22
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« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2009, 11:14:31 PM » |
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I also think this is a great idea, but for complex plans you may need to have a way to designate what part is the "center" of the plan before it gets turned into this linear type drawing. Otherwise you may wind up with the drawing not matching your desired frame of reference.
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santerdam
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« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2009, 02:23:35 AM » |
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Tony,
It is not always true that you have a single "center of the plan". Specially on large plans, you will find mulitiple "centers". On shows I have have seen plans, build from many sections, where each section is a "center". Each "center" has it's own "train traffic controller" (I don't know the English word for this job) and each person is responsable for his "controlled area" and scedules trains to neighbouring regions.
The way to design the Symbolic plans ("linear type drawing") is very much related to the story you want to express with your plan. Or the "traffic game" you want to play when controlling a complex plan with a team of many "train traffic controllers".
IMHO setting up a "linear type drawing" is the final step, long after you designed, tested and build the track. I invite everybody to give an opinion for the "Symbolic Library".
Sander
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« Last Edit: April 21, 2009, 02:30:00 AM by santerdam »
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tony22
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Posts: 17
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« Reply #8 on: April 22, 2009, 01:18:47 AM » |
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Sander, I defer to your explanation. It makes sense!  |
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Chris
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« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2009, 12:39:25 PM » |
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The sooner the better! I am about to rebuild my control panel so that I can add controls for setting signals, turnouts and uncouplers. My current 500mm panel ( http://trains.manvell.org.uk/z-scale/layout/images/DSCN1032-power-control-panel.jpg) will end up almost twice as long! As you can see it has two 'centres', not because each one will have its own operator but because to mimic the actual topology of the layout would require a panel nearly twice as deep and, therefore, more cumbersome. The creation of a schematic would have to done independently from the actual track plan in order to be able to fit all the switches in without making the panel even bigger. So, you can see why I am enthusiastic about the idea of a 'Symbolic' Library. All the best, Chris. |
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santerdam
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« Reply #10 on: April 23, 2009, 03:10:21 PM » |
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In case you want to make a control panel, this is how I did some tests :
- Export the image to .png or .jpg (.png is better for scaling)
- Use a photo-editor to flip the image (make it 'up-side-down')
- Print on a transparant (in my case an overheadsheet)
- Place the transparant up-side-down on the control panel
On a transparant sheet, the printed side can get damaged when it is in use on the control panel. By flipping the image you can mount the sheet up-side-down. This prevents you for the risk of damage and scratches.
For large panels, I found that copy-shops have transparant film, up to 70 cm wide, on a roll. The material is slightly thicker than overhead sheets. Copy-shops have specific software to print on really large scale (5+ meters), often used for printing banners.
Sander
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santerdam
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« Reply #11 on: April 29, 2009, 12:01:06 AM » |
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David,
Thanks for the Symbolic Library in version 3.26.0. As you understand, I couldn't wait doing a test.
Flat layouts work fine. All grid-elements are drawn horizontal.
In case of vertical lines, I am getting troubles. Rotating elements for 90° doesn't help, since the grid doesn't match. The AnyRail grid-elements are (in mm) 100 width and 30 height, like a rectangle.
The difference with Uhlenbrock Track Controll is, that they use a square grid. That makes it possible to rotate for both 45° and 90° without loosing the grid.
As example see attached test-symbolic track to demonstrate. Notice the left- and right- trackparts. (I did not switch off the endpoint and connection size to make the problem visible) You can't connect the vertical parts to the horizontal parts.
Sander
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David
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« Reply #12 on: April 29, 2009, 12:25:30 AM » |
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Hi Sander, To be honest, our expertise is not that big in this area. So if you can point us to any reliable resource, don't hesitate to do so! We followed the Uhlenbrock system, where you have rectangular elements. See here. They also have a simple program to create similar Gleisbildstellpulte. Uhlenbrock claims to follow the prototype used in Germany, as decribed (in German) here. Of course, we can add a few elements to facilitate vertical track, although that is not usually done in real life control panels. Please let me know if you need them! Viessmann uses a square grid. See here. We might add a similar system later as another library. If we're completely off, please let us know! I know there's a lot to learn in this area... David. |
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David Hoogvorst
Founder and Owner of DRail Modelspoor Software
Creator of AnyRail
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santerdam
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« Reply #13 on: April 29, 2009, 12:47:40 AM » |
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David, don't expect me to be a real expert. I only did some tests with the other systems. The Uhlenbrock trick is they rotate the black line on the element, each time you click the element. That way you can rotate each element "horizontal like -", "diagonal like /", "vertical like |" and "diagonal like \".
In Anyrail, it is easy to get the same result with some extra elements.
See attached my 'artist impression' to give you an idea for some extra elements.
Sander
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santerdam
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« Reply #14 on: April 29, 2009, 01:22:18 AM » |
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David wrote : "we can add a few elements to facilitate vertical track, although that is not usually done in real life control panels."
You can check the large photo in the first post in this topic. On the largest panel on that photo you can see how they design diagonal and vertical track.
Sander
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