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Topic: How to set up a doughnit (shelf) layout  (Read 167 times)

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Offline J1Love

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How to set up a doughnit (shelf) layout
« on: February 12, 2019, 04:15:35 pm »

Hi.
I'm having trouble setting up a shelf layout (bench work layer) in anyrail 6.  What I want to design is an 18 inch shelf around the walls of a room 16 feet square.  From what I have seen so far (unless I've missed someone's topic in my search), all the advice centers around tables (regular and irregular shaped) AWAY from the walls.  I'm trying to design a shelf layout attached to my 4 walls.  PLEASE HELP!

Offline Tom Springer

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Re: How to set up a doughnit (shelf) layout
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2019, 06:07:26 pm »
More specifics, please.

What are you looking for help with?  How to set up the AnyRail layout for the room?  Ideas on what types of plans would work?  What have you generated so far in terms of your layout space, sample room configuration including openings, items that have to be worked around, etc.?

If it's room layout you need help with, basic room configuration would help.

If it's track possibilities, what type(s) of configurations do you have in mind?  If you can post what you have so far, and identify the scale and era you plan to model, it would help.  Era somewhat determines the type of equipment you are considering - steam or diesel, freight or passenger, types of industries you want, maybe even location you want to model.

Offline J1Love

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Re: How to set up a doughnit (shelf) layout
« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2019, 07:51:46 pm »
Hi Tom;
I am looking for help setting my grid to layout my benchwork as a first step in my design process.  My design will be a double track loop with a yard along one wall and industry sidings along the other 3 walls.   as mentioned before, my space is 16 ft by 16 ft, and the 18 inch shelves will be placed approximately 5 ft high from my floor to accommodate my music desks, and other stuff underneath.  I model HO SCALE and desire a minimum mainline radius of 28 inches (I don't anticipate that being a problem due to the simplicity of my planned loop).
My basic rook configuration is simple- there are 2 entrances along my south wall- I have a .jpg attached, not to scale of course-that's what anyrail is for!
I also have a yard designed, but I'm not sure if it will fit........see the other not to scale design below.
As for the rest oi your suggestions, my location is LOOSELY based in Cincinnatti OH in 2 eras- Transition era (1945-1955; big steam & early diesel) and modern (1985-1995 end of caboose usage).  That way I can justify all the RR's I have collected over the years.  I want a coal based operation with an engine terminal (no roundhouse); I can provide more details if you like, but I'm primarily concerned with the scale drawing of bench-work first
« Last Edit: February 12, 2019, 07:53:35 pm by J1Love »

Offline Tom Springer

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Re: How to set up a doughnit (shelf) layout
« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2019, 09:07:34 pm »
Setting up the AnyRail file should be "simple" (attached); just a basic square with the center area blacked out so track can't be put there.  Of course, you'd be doing a lot of zooming in and out to see track and things as you develop them.  Perhaps setting this up in the beginning just showing the "mainline" track run, then dividing each part into one or more "sections" (modules), and creating each of those as separate AnyRail files (once the actual positions of the mainline tracks at each "section" edge is known), might allow you to develop the parts individually, then bring all of them together at the end.

Is this your first layout?  Speaking from personal experience (school of hard lessons learned), we tend to make our first layout way too much, not realizing that building it, wiring it, and making it actually work is a steep learning curve, especially when space is small and we try to get too much into it.  There are old model railroaders, there are bold model railroaders, but there aren't many old and bold ones.

Might you consider something like a dogbone (point-to-point that loops back on itself) to get your double-track "loop", instead of just having an oval that runs all around the room's 4 sides ? Personally, I'm not a fan of removable sections as I believe they cause too many operational issues.  My fear is that the section at the stairs, needing a curved track on it, might be just this case; getting the connections perfect so as not to be the source of derailments might be a lot of work.  If there was room at that side for some sort of a peninsula, I think you'd have a better configuration.  If at all possible, doing the same by the laundry door should also be a consideration

Have you looked at any of the published plans to see if there is something that might look similar to what you are trying to create?  Sometimes these plans not only can inspire and suggest concepts, but also show limitations physical space imposes.

Offline Future-Digital

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Re: How to set up a doughnit (shelf) layout
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2019, 10:24:27 pm »
I would like to suggest a word of caution. You stated that you wanted your shelves to be about 5 feet off the floor.

Don't. There is a reason that most layouts are around 30 to 48 inches.


Experience.


It is hard to see and work on a 5 foot layout. You will lose much of the joy of it at that altitude.

Trust me, I tried it. Now I have one at 40 inches and it is MUCH more fun.

Just my 2 cents. Enjoy!

Bill

Offline Tom Springer

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Re: How to set up a doughnit (shelf) layout
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2019, 01:58:27 am »
I thought the 5ft height was due to the other room uses and his equipment being underneath the shelf space so the height was "predetermined" in order to co-exist.  If the case, probably means movable platforms to stand on to see down onto the track and provide the ability to work on the layout.

My concern is about having an 18inch wide space for HO scale and trying to have any turning loops.  Curves around a corner can be made to work, even double-tracked curves, but trying to get anything like a reversed course might not be possible, in which case one gets trains that just "go around and around".  With a small peninsula at each end of the room, a solution to that limitation/restriction might be possible.  And a peninsula might remove the need for the removable sections.  i.e., allow a dogbone layout style.

Offline J1Love

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Re: How to set up a doughnit (shelf) layout
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2019, 11:04:08 am »
Tom;
First of all thanks for the file, that is exactly what I need- I'll use it as a template for my shelf bench-work..  I should explain my limitations a bit to answer some questions above as well-
This room is already being used for music production and a DJ studio, also I am a STUBBORN recent double leg amputee.
If I was starting with a true blank slate, AND had done it right by designing the room first BEFORE collecting a TON of large engines & other rolling stock (since I was 16, now I'm 53) my design would've been MUCH more operations-oriented.  However, due to those factors, I am limited to a tail-chaser layout (loop) with a yard & a few industry sidings.  To accommodate my equipment and to try to get some operational possibility, I'm focusing on a proper yard, coal mine, and engine facility as my primary design goals.
I am using this project as part of my physical therapy and rehab- I cannot enjoy my trains sitting down!!  So again THANKS for all the suggestions above and wish me luck! 

Offline Future-Digital

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Re: How to set up a doughnit (shelf) layout
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2019, 06:09:59 pm »
Hooray for YOU? You go, guy. Have at it.

Offline Tom Springer

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Re: How to set up a doughnit (shelf) layout
« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2019, 04:47:21 am »
A few years back, a friend was severely injured in a motorcycle accident and lost the use of his legs.  As part of his "new life", he decided that he wanted a layout he could operate from a chair.  I was part of the group that helped develop a layout for him.  Doing that allowed me to learn a lot from a perspective I never once considered: not being able to crawl over or under a layout.  And the operational aspects of that layout were a world apart from what I'd ever thought of previously.

I greatly admire what you want to accomplish.

But I need to ask you 2 basic questions that will influence everything that follows in the future.

First, is this your first layout?  That makes an enormous difference in what you might build.  Construction of a layout is hard enough, especially in the beginning for people who haven't done it before. Between getting track laid correctly to avoid operational issues (even for the most experienced), wiring, setting up the operational aspects (i.e., things like turnout handling/operating, etc.), we all find that our first layout never goes as planned, and what we do in these areas changes over time as each of us get more experience. The most common mistake we all have made is trying for too much in our first layout.

Second, ignoring your room design, limitations, etc. what is it you really want from your layout? 

You said
... my design would've been MUCH more operations-oriented.

If you want operations ... if that is what you would really enjoy doing ... then why not make that the primary objective instead of trying to fit some design to your room ... why not find a smaller, workable design that let's you enjoy operating it, even if all of the available space around the 4 walls isn't used.

If you don't have a specific prototype/location in mind, why not just create one that meets your requirement, something like a short-line that serves your coal mine and has a small engine facility for fueling/service and allows you a small yard to interchange with a bigger road that operates "outside your layout".

If you are open to any of this, knowing what equipment you already have, and, perhaps, what subset of it you would actually operate with and what would be 'store' in the yard, would be helpful.  Same for any existing track elements and structures you already have.

In my view ... you could construct this "small" layout with a view to eventually expanding it to the other areas of your room space, sort of using a "modular" or staged approach, keeping the first stage or two simple in terms of substructure and wiring needed, and progress as you get your skills developed.

You want a coal mine, so what does that look like?  Is there a Walthers structure you like?  What do you need to service that mine?  How many cars in and out?  Gons or hoppers? Anything else?  Supplies coming in?

Before worrying about what the track looks like, can you create a "concept" plan for the mine?  A brief written description, say half a page long?

A railroad develops based on the industries it wants to serve, then around the physical structure it would operate in. So, too, should a layout.  After all, it is a railroad.

So what do you want your road to be?  What might it look like?  Then it can be fit to the space you have.  And future expansion roughly "penciled" in.

Have you a preferred location to model?  Or railroad?  Era?

I'm sure that many here would like to help you with contributions.  I'm good at asking questions.